at 03:15 PM, 9/11/04

I take issue with your statement that the IBM Selectric Composer was not available with "any" kind of memory until 1975. My high school journalism department had two of them when I went there, and very lovely and expensive machines they were. We used them to produce justified camera-ready copy for our school newspaper and yearbook. I probably spent a couple hundred hours typing on them, all together, starting in fall 1974 until summer 1976. I don't think the machines were new the year I started, but I don't know how long they'd been there.

Anyway, though I'm quite sure our Composers did not do kerning, they did have variable-width fonts, and they could "remember" the widths of the letters that had been typed on the current line, until you pressed the carriage-return key (um, that's what we called the "Enter" key, kids). It had two different backspace keys, if I'm remembering right, or maybe one key that did two things depending on how hard it was pressed -- anyway, one backspacing option was to backspace exactly the width of the last character typed. And you could backspace in this way, a variable-width character at a time, all the way to the beginning of a line. So they definitely were able to "remember" at least the widths of the characters that had been typed on that line.

However, they DEFINITELY did not kern. Every time you typed an "m" on a variable-width font, the machine gave the "m" 9 little spaces (sized according to the size of this font), and every time you typed an "i" it gave it 4 little spaces, and so on, and it made no difference which other letters were typed nearby.

To me, the discussion over whether someone "could" have used an IBM Selectric Composer to get the effects seen in the CBS forgeries is beyond what's strictly needed to recognize them as forgeries. I can tell you that even if it were possible to get those effects, it wasn't easy, and it's unreasonable to imagine that anyone would have gone to the trouble to do so for a mere memo to the file: especially not Killian, who as a non-typist would hardly have known how to do it.

Aaron at 03:35 PM, 9/11/04

Anyway, though I'm quite sure our Composers did not do kerning, they did have variable-width fonts, and they could "remember" the widths of the letters that had been typed on the current line, until you pressed the carriage-return key...

That's right, it could do that, but kerning actually requires a bit of "thinking machine" technology, "memory" in the modern technological sense. According to Dr. Bouffard and some others, this was available in 1975, but not before.

Another point is that these documents are apparently ("apparently", as at this point, this discussion is getting way beyond my depth and I have to defer entirely to experts like Dr. Bouffard) not even truly kerned, but rather have a form of pseudo-kerning, something similar to kerning, that is unique to programs like Microsoft Word. Which, well, that uniqueness is just yet another God-damning-to-Hell bit, especially when you consider that the documents produced by Word are identical in every way.

Mister at 01:45 AM, 9/15/04

especially not Killian, who as a non-typist would hardly have known how to do it

The memo would have been typed from notes by Killian's secretary.

especially when you consider that the documents produced by Word are identical in every way.

No, it isn't identical in every way. The Times New Roman font in Word has a different 4 than the one used in the documents.

Look, the documents may well yet prove to be forgeries, but NOT because they were typed in Word (they were not,) and not because Killian's son says his Dad would not have kept a CYA file (he did - his secretary says so,) and not because his signature looks different from one form to the next. The only way to prove the forgerie will be to see the original. The copies have nothing in them to indict them as fraudulent. In 1972, the Selectric typewriter could have created exactly the documents in question, and they could have been typed by anyone in Killian's office and handed to him for his signature.

But that doesn't mean that they were. Frankly, their authenticity is still in question, but they absolutely have not been debunked.

Aaron at 02:32 AM, 9/15/04

The memo would have been typed from notes by Killian's secretary.

Killian's secretary says she didn't type them, and says that they are fakes.

No, it isn't identical in every way. The Times New Roman font in Word has a different 4 than the one used in the documents.

Actually, according to Dr. Bouffard, the 4 only matches Times New Roman. The only claim I've heard that they don't match regards a supposed difference in the curvature of the 8. I've looked at it, and I don't see it, but I'm not an expert. CBS has apparently deliberately avoided discussing Times New Roman except to say that "that typing style" existed in 1972. (Times New Roman did not: It was invented by Microsoft for Windows, Times Roman, a much wider font, was what was invented in the 1930's.)

Look, the documents may well yet prove to be forgeries, but NOT because they were typed in Word (they were not,)

Then why do the documents superimpose perfectly with a document typed under the default settings for Microsoft Word?

and not because Killian's son says his Dad would not have kept a CYA file (he did - his secretary says so,) and not because his signature looks different from one form to the next

Of course not. Those are merely circumstantial pieces of supporting evidence.

The only way to prove the forgerie will be to see the original. The copies have nothing in them to indict them as fraudulent.

...whatever you say...

In 1972, the Selectric typewriter could have created exactly the documents in question

As a matter of fact, while some typewriters (as CBS keeps repeating over and over in their "defense" segments) could do proportional spacing in 1972, the Selectric was one that specifically did not have that capability. There's a $10,500 reward if you can do it with a Selectric or anything else, and plenty of period models on eBay. I encourage you to go for it! People have been trying all week, even posting their attempts online, and it simply isn't working. No typewriter in 1972 yet identified is capable of matching the layout used in the memos. Word, however, not only matches the layout by default, but automatically word wraps at the *same* places as the memos. The webmaster at Selectric.org agrees that they were made in Word.

Now, you might be talking about the IBM Selectric Composer, a multi-thousand dollar typesetting machine that they didn't have in that office at that time, as it's been speculated that this could've been done. (Specifically, the Boston Globe deliberately misquoted Dr. Bouffard to imply it could've happened. He is irate, and protests he never said any such thing, because it can't.) The Composer could do proportional spacing, and had a similar font called Press Roman. However, they tried that, and it doesn't work. The font is simply different.

If you're certain this can be done, however, I'll help you out here: Here's an original Selectric on eBay. Here's another. Or, there's this one, that even comes with a fake Bush memo inside! Lots of differnet font balls on eBay, too, so knock yourself out, because there's big money in it for you if you can. I'll take a 10% finder's fee for pointing you in the right direction.

Mister at 04:14 AM, 9/15/04

<scripted "th" the character appears well above the top of the numeral one beside it. Word absolutely does not do this. But a typewriter occassionally will.

I read the article where Killian's secretary says she didn't type them. She also says that they had a Selectric and another brand with the superscripted "th". But the fact that she didn't type them (unless it is just a case of poor memory - she's 86) doesn't mean that another secretary didn't.

Incidentally, the default setting for Word also superscripts the "st". There are three occurances of "1st" in the documents. None are superscripted. If the argument is that the "forger" forgot to turn off the default settings, how do you explain the un-superscripted "st"s?

Also, Bush has released documents with the superscripting and the proportional spacing.

Word, however, not only matches the layout by default, but automatically word wraps at the *same* places as the memos.

Why is that so significant? If the text is proportional, the line length and margins will dictate that. And actually, it only does this if you force the margins or reset the type size. The default margins and default point size in Word create a different word-wrapping.

However, I'll concede that the typewriter may not have been a Selectric. Perhaps it was a D model IBM Executive.

Here is a picture of the Executive Model D

Here is an ad for the Executive where they boast of proportional spacing capability

Aaron at 05:09 AM, 9/15/04

I think you ran over the 7500 character limit on comments, I should install a counter, but...<scripted "th" the character appears well above the top of the numeral one beside it. Word absolutely does not do this. But a typewriter occassionally will.</blockquote><script "th" was too high for Word, since when you type it up in Word, it appears much lower. If you *print* it, you'll find that the superscript th in Times New Roman appears *precisely* where it does on the "memos".

</i>And? No one is seriously arguing that these features didn't exist in 1972. (Except Dan Rather when he's looking for a quote to make himself look legitimate.) Just that they help the process of elimination to rule out a mass of possible fonts and machines, leaving only one clear possibility: Microsoft Word in Times New Roman.<blockquote>Why is that so significant? If the text is proportional, the line length and margins will dictate that.

Because typists were conventionally taught to just use a hyphen at the end of a line, as is done in this excerpt from an actual IBM manual from the era.

And actually, it only does this if you force the margins or reset the type size. The default margins and default point size in Word create a different word-wrapping.

Bull. Go do it. Standard 12 point Times New Roman creates a perfect match for the memos. The first time I did it, the second line was off, but that was only until I realized I'd forgotten to put a space in "sugar coat".

However, I'll concede that the typewriter may not have been a Selectric. Perhaps it was a D model IBM Executive.

Which Killian's secretary says they didn't have. In any case, once again, Selectric.org tried this theory. The spacing is nowhere close. Once again, only Microsoft's Times New Roman fits. As with all other previous similar fonts, the similar font used by the Executive was far too wide.

at 09:40 PM, 9/20/04

I do not understand all this hooplah over a "th". For those of who remember the 70s, you know we used to make superscripted letters on typewriters that did not have superscript functions. Just roll the roller down a bit, hit the key, go back and force it between stops, and hit the second key. You could also do it if you hit the shift key just right. I did it all the time, especially when typing numeric orders in wirting and math classes in school. Anyway, I remember when I got my first electric typewriter and it had a "th". Not to tell my age but that would have been mid- to late-seventies.

Bloggers, get over yourselves...you are not "experts". But having said that, it is sad that the news media does not investigate or confirm anything anymore and we folks have to be so damn suspicious of everything they say.

Aaron at 02:40 AM, 9/21/04

I do not understand all this hooplah over a "th".

Neither do I: No one has presented that as a leading theory. In fact, that's explained above. If you look at the evidence instead of the "evidence" Rather pretends to present, you'll find that he was BSing when he said that was the "focus".

you are not "experts".

In fact, some of us are. That's what makes the blogosphere work: People from every conceivable field of expertise are involved or know someone who is. It's the world's greatest bullshit detector. CBS's own experts have also come forward to say CBS lied about their statements.

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