One day, America will be able to burn Jupiter for fuel.
Made In America
From Scottish Parts
“Listen up, meatheads.”
6:12 am, 9/3/05
Uh, check out this story from August 28th.
In the face of a catastrophic Hurricane Katrina, a mandatory evacuation was ordered Sunday for New Orleans by Mayor Ray Nagin.Wait a minute. Are you kidding me? These ostensible chief executives couldn't seriously have been so clueless that the only reason they finally bothered to evacuate was because the President called them up on the telephone and told them how to do their jobs? I'd like to find an exact quote.
The mayor called the order unprecedented and said anyone who could leave the city should. He exempted hotels from the evacuation order because airlines had already cancelled all flights.
Gov. Kathleen Blanco, standing beside the mayor at a news conference, said President Bush called and personally appealed for a mandatory evacuation for the low-lying city, which is prone to flooding.
Update: I guess the hundreds of buses Mayor Nagin didn't use to take the poor out of the city would be a lot more upsetting if there'd been time to organize them. On the other hand, that wouldn't have been a problem if they'd ordered it 72 hours beforehand, like their evacuation plan appears to have told them to.
Update: Threshold State has a handy list to help you keep track of who is at fault. Personally, I think he should put together an easy-to-understand flowchart. IMAO provides a list of lessons learned:
The job of the Mayor is to take care of the people in his city. When he fails at that - his secondary job becomes blaming the federal government.Apparently, he and Blanco imagined their duties to be more, shall we say, "advisory", or perhaps that their offices were honorary, like being King and Queen of Mardi Gras. I've been about as kind as I can to Nagin, but alongside Blanco's obliviousness it's looking like the locals really phoned this one in, big time. Maybe they should've hired Mayor Giualiani as a consultant.
Update: Meet the man, speaking Thursday:
An angry Terry Ebbert, head of New Orleans' emergency operations, watched the slow exodus from the Superdome and said the Federal Emergency Management Agency response was inadequate...."FEMA has been here three days, yet there is no command and control," Ebbert said. "We can send massive amounts of aid to tsunami victims, but we can't bail out the city of New Orleans."Ebbert is the New Orleans head of Homeland Security, appointed by Mayor Nagin. He's supposed to be command and control, yet there he was complaining that no one was doing his job for him. As Jason at CounterColumn said:
Yeah, you got the hardest job in the world right now. Harder than the governor's. It's even harder if you're not doing it.Was anybody down there awake for this?
Update: President Bush, noting Governor Blanco's screwups, has asked Blanco to let the grownups take over, and Governor Blanco says "no, if I do that, people might realize I've screwed up":
Behind the scenes, a power struggle emerged, as federal officials tried to wrest authority from Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco (D). Shortly before midnight Friday, the Bush administration sent her a proposed legal memorandum asking her to request a federal takeover of the evacuation of New Orleans, a source within the state's emergency operations center said Saturday.Was this guy high? "We're in charge of it, and we aren't letting anybody else take charge of it, but we are not to be held responsible for it"?
The administration had sought control over National Guard units, normally under control of the governor. Louisiana officials rejected the request, noting that such a move would be comparable to a federal declaration of martial law...."Quite frankly, if they'd been able to pull off taking it away from the locals, they then could have blamed everything on the locals," said the source, who is an adviser and does not have the authority to speak publicly.
The incredible Washington Post headline? "White House Shifts Blame".
Update: One of Arthur Chrenkoff's readers notes that people weren't running around in circles over in Mississippi. Apparently, their officials aren't cartoonish parodies of real leaders.
Free tip - contrast the Louisiana situation with the one next door in Mississippi - Gov. Barbour (R-MS). What's been lost in all the blather over New Orleans is that it was really Mississippi that took the big hit. The buildings in New Orleans are still standing; the Gulf Coast of Mississippi basically has been scrubbed, like God took out a pencil eraser and just erased it...I really don't like to find fault at times like this, but one thing that was missing was a quick recognition that in such a situation the potential for civil collapse is nearly 100%. Once the weather settles, you need to immediately declare marshal law and send in the MPs. That's basically what Haley Barbour did in Mississippi - there were a few early problems but very quickly the MPs were patrolling what was left of Biloxi and Gulfport and keeping a lid on things. Back on Tuesday when I put on the news and we all saw Kathleen Blanco bursting into tears, I knew that was the wrong message and would bring trouble. Louisiana and New Orleans basically have those touchy-feely, "I'm okay, you're okay" soft-leftie types in charge. Their education took a few days and has been expensive.I just hope we don't have a disaster here in Illinois that forces us to have an "incompetent bureaucracy drag race" to the bottom. It's bad enough that he runs the highway system, the last thing I need is my life in Governor Blagojevich's hands.
Amidst all the hyperventilating that's going on, it's actually a good time for a civics lesson, particularly watching the competence of the people in Mississippi and the gross incompetence of almost all concerned in Louisiana....Mississippi got hammered much worse than Louisiana but is barely in the news because the leadership has been much more competent. Ms. Blanco is clearly way out of her league in this situation.
This was a good reminder that LA has for decades been our worst managed and most corrupt state.
at 09:23 AM, 9/3/05
The lethargic press conference Nagin had on Sunday morning was about 24 hours before the full brunt of the hurricane but even less time than that to realistically evacuate (since you can't evacuate lots of people when the storm is closing in). He was legalistic and nonchalant. It was Sunday brunch at Antoine's. There was no sense of urgency. Given his post hurricane reactions, I think his hurricane plan was to wait for the Feds.
The lethargic press conference Nagin had on Sunday morning was about 24 hours before the full brunt of the hurricane but even less time than that to realistically evacuate (since you can't evacuate lots of people when the storm is closing in). He was legalistic and nonchalant. It was Sunday brunch at Antoine's. There was no sense of urgency. Given his post hurricane reactions, I think his hurricane plan was to wait for the Feds.
at 09:55 AM, 9/3/05
Well, 72 hours before the hurricane warnings aren't accurate enough, and didn't yet point to New Orleans. But 48 hours before they certainly did, and it should have been evacuated on Saturday, the same time as the President pre-declared the disaster area.
Well, 72 hours before the hurricane warnings aren't accurate enough, and didn't yet point to New Orleans. But 48 hours before they certainly did, and it should have been evacuated on Saturday, the same time as the President pre-declared the disaster area.
at 10:16 AM, 9/3/05
Does your family have an evacuation / disaster plan? If not, now is the time to get one in place. Let's not rely exclusively on the government to help us out in times of disaster. It can happen to any of us and we must be ready!
Does your family have an evacuation / disaster plan? If not, now is the time to get one in place. Let's not rely exclusively on the government to help us out in times of disaster. It can happen to any of us and we must be ready!
at 10:28 AM, 9/3/05
Ruth
Are you talking about taking personal responsibility for oneself? What a unique idea.
/s
If people want to complain about response time, think what a mess it would be if the President had waited until after the storm to declare it a disaster area. Bush should get an A+ for how he's handled his portion.
Ruth
Are you talking about taking personal responsibility for oneself? What a unique idea.
/s
If people want to complain about response time, think what a mess it would be if the President had waited until after the storm to declare it a disaster area. Bush should get an A+ for how he's handled his portion.
at 10:34 AM, 9/3/05
Exactly. I can't even imagine how much worse it would have been if President Bush had not asked the governor of LA to start the evacuation.
Exactly. I can't even imagine how much worse it would have been if President Bush had not asked the governor of LA to start the evacuation.
at 11:05 AM, 9/3/05
at 11:27 AM, 9/3/05
at 11:52 AM, 9/3/05
The five day projections at NOAA last week put NO on the bad side of the Hurricane at about 70%. They could have started planning then, but not actually moblizing anything. On 10 AM saturday morning the National Hurricane Center issued its hurricane warning for NO. At this point mandatory evacuation should have been issued and plans which should have been formulated put into action. The president should not have had to beg for the order on Saturday night and the local officials should not have dithered a couple hours before acting on his plea.
OBVIOUSLY the plan should have included using school buses rather than have them lie idle. In addition the plan should have included using the Illinois Central RR to bring water and food into the city and people out. This should have been easy.
Just as a side thought, the US should have a prison train or three to evacuate prisoners. p
The five day projections at NOAA last week put NO on the bad side of the Hurricane at about 70%. They could have started planning then, but not actually moblizing anything. On 10 AM saturday morning the National Hurricane Center issued its hurricane warning for NO. At this point mandatory evacuation should have been issued and plans which should have been formulated put into action. The president should not have had to beg for the order on Saturday night and the local officials should not have dithered a couple hours before acting on his plea.
OBVIOUSLY the plan should have included using school buses rather than have them lie idle. In addition the plan should have included using the Illinois Central RR to bring water and food into the city and people out. This should have been easy.
Just as a side thought, the US should have a prison train or three to evacuate prisoners. p
at 03:22 PM, 9/3/05
Jarhed Said: (though not in the UK, as guns are harder to get than drugs here)
To which I reply:
I was in England/Scotland/Ireland for 5 years and could always find guns and drugs. It was my job: a Yank undercover. Made me have a lot more respect for the 2nd amendment.
Jarhed Said: (though not in the UK, as guns are harder to get than drugs here)
To which I reply:
I was in England/Scotland/Ireland for 5 years and could always find guns and drugs. It was my job: a Yank undercover. Made me have a lot more respect for the 2nd amendment.
at 04:29 PM, 9/3/05
Aaron, the way I read this, NO and LA had disaster response plans, and a disaster response organization, but it was all talk. It's likely that they never walked the walk.
I'd like to see if the city ever conducted any disaster drills, or exercises (even tabletops). A quick Google only brought one hurricane exercise by the Corps of Engineers in May 2001.
Aaron, the way I read this, NO and LA had disaster response plans, and a disaster response organization, but it was all talk. It's likely that they never walked the walk.
I'd like to see if the city ever conducted any disaster drills, or exercises (even tabletops). A quick Google only brought one hurricane exercise by the Corps of Engineers in May 2001.
at 06:08 PM, 9/3/05
at 06:58 PM, 9/3/05
I'm curious - is anyone in a position to know if the schools identified as shelters in the emergency plan survived the hurricane/flood?
With hindsight were those better choices than the Superdome? The plan is to shelter 100,000 - would the schools have been able to house that many?
I'm curious - is anyone in a position to know if the schools identified as shelters in the emergency plan survived the hurricane/flood?
With hindsight were those better choices than the Superdome? The plan is to shelter 100,000 - would the schools have been able to house that many?
at 09:27 PM, 9/3/05
When aid has come in and all evacuees are taken care of and clean-up has begun, someone without an axe to grind needs to investigate what went down 72 hours out from the hurricane until the levees broke and write a report. If it turns out that the mayor was on autopilot and didn't do his job or follow the evacuation plan, he should be brought up on charges for dereliction of duty. I know it sounds harsh, but elected officials must be held accountible or these things will continue to occur. This goes for the emergency management head as well as other municipal leaders. The Governor is also at fault, and should face her own investigation. The voters of Louisiana deserve to know how their leaders failed them.
When aid has come in and all evacuees are taken care of and clean-up has begun, someone without an axe to grind needs to investigate what went down 72 hours out from the hurricane until the levees broke and write a report. If it turns out that the mayor was on autopilot and didn't do his job or follow the evacuation plan, he should be brought up on charges for dereliction of duty. I know it sounds harsh, but elected officials must be held accountible or these things will continue to occur. This goes for the emergency management head as well as other municipal leaders. The Governor is also at fault, and should face her own investigation. The voters of Louisiana deserve to know how their leaders failed them.
at 09:38 PM, 9/3/05
at 11:17 PM, 9/3/05
"Program on the emergence of civilization."
Guess I'd better get my tin foil hat on.
"Program on the emergence of civilization."
Guess I'd better get my tin foil hat on.
at 11:37 PM, 9/3/05
It is hard to come up with words to describe that utterly incompetent buffoon Nagin. The man is such an obvious fool. I watched most of the coverage this week and certainly the administration deserves some harsh criticism, particularly for Chertoff and Gonzales. But for the good mayor to have "ordered" an evacuation and then allowed hospitals and nursing homes to remain occupied is simply criminal neglect. The sight of those elderly people, slumped over in wheelchairs, dehydrated and succumbing to the elements, was sickening, all the more so because it was totally unnecessary. They should not have been there, period. What kind of local "leaders" haven't a clue as to who resides in their own communities, who the city's most vulnerable citizens are and what will be needed to help them in a disaster, a PREDICTED disaster? The whole thing was getting to be too awful to watch. And now we will all be treated to speeches from black "leaders" about our shortcomings with no words from these same idiots about the murder, rape, and depravity of those who fired at people trying to rescue Kayne West's "people". This country has lost it. Big time.
It is hard to come up with words to describe that utterly incompetent buffoon Nagin. The man is such an obvious fool. I watched most of the coverage this week and certainly the administration deserves some harsh criticism, particularly for Chertoff and Gonzales. But for the good mayor to have "ordered" an evacuation and then allowed hospitals and nursing homes to remain occupied is simply criminal neglect. The sight of those elderly people, slumped over in wheelchairs, dehydrated and succumbing to the elements, was sickening, all the more so because it was totally unnecessary. They should not have been there, period. What kind of local "leaders" haven't a clue as to who resides in their own communities, who the city's most vulnerable citizens are and what will be needed to help them in a disaster, a PREDICTED disaster? The whole thing was getting to be too awful to watch. And now we will all be treated to speeches from black "leaders" about our shortcomings with no words from these same idiots about the murder, rape, and depravity of those who fired at people trying to rescue Kayne West's "people". This country has lost it. Big time.
at 12:21 AM, 9/4/05
Ray Nagin is as good as it gets in New Orleans. He's not corrupt, was a leading ComCast Exec. What the heck happened?
My guess is that after Ivan swerved and all those people evaced for "nothing" Nagin caught so much grief "Louisiana Logic" that he felt he was not able to do anything unless it was a sure thing. His own plan called for a 72 hour lead time and evacing hospitals, nursing homes, and other special needs folks. He instead did nothing. I think he just gave up.
Georges in 1998 showed the same problems cropping up now, lots of theft and violence in the Superdome; Ivan last year had almost no one in the Superdome so no problems.
But the thing to remember is that Nagin did not even BEGIN to follow his own plan that he constructed. THAT is damning.
Ray Nagin is as good as it gets in New Orleans. He's not corrupt, was a leading ComCast Exec. What the heck happened?
My guess is that after Ivan swerved and all those people evaced for "nothing" Nagin caught so much grief "Louisiana Logic" that he felt he was not able to do anything unless it was a sure thing. His own plan called for a 72 hour lead time and evacing hospitals, nursing homes, and other special needs folks. He instead did nothing. I think he just gave up.
Georges in 1998 showed the same problems cropping up now, lots of theft and violence in the Superdome; Ivan last year had almost no one in the Superdome so no problems.
But the thing to remember is that Nagin did not even BEGIN to follow his own plan that he constructed. THAT is damning.
at 04:43 AM, 9/4/05
I totally agree. Bush should get an A+ for appointing a man who had no idea what a disaster zone looked like to the head of FEMA. Boy, there's nothing like learning on the job!
Bush is a hero for creating an organization such as the Department of Homeland Security! It passed its first test with such flying colors! No administrative mishaps at all!
What in the world will it take to convince some people that Bush is completely incompetent?!?
I totally agree. Bush should get an A+ for appointing a man who had no idea what a disaster zone looked like to the head of FEMA. Boy, there's nothing like learning on the job!
Bush is a hero for creating an organization such as the Department of Homeland Security! It passed its first test with such flying colors! No administrative mishaps at all!
What in the world will it take to convince some people that Bush is completely incompetent?!?
at 09:46 AM, 9/4/05
galamud: BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAH BLAH BLAH.....That's all you Arses on the left can do. You offer no fresh ideas. Nothing.
Blame those who deserve the blame..the local administration who dropped the ball.
They're the ones who fled the city while leaving behind thousands of people whom they were SWORN to PROTECT.
You people DISGUST ME. You have no compassion,You HAVE NO SHAME.
It makes me sick to call you an AMERICAN.
You and all of your fellow travelers are no more that dirt. And that gives a bad name to dirt. Get out,Get out before it's too late. If you so hate this country and offer nothing to her but your foul mouthing..GET OUT!
galamud: BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAME BUSH BLAH BLAH BLAH.....That's all you Arses on the left can do. You offer no fresh ideas. Nothing.
Blame those who deserve the blame..the local administration who dropped the ball.
They're the ones who fled the city while leaving behind thousands of people whom they were SWORN to PROTECT.
You people DISGUST ME. You have no compassion,You HAVE NO SHAME.
It makes me sick to call you an AMERICAN.
You and all of your fellow travelers are no more that dirt. And that gives a bad name to dirt. Get out,Get out before it's too late. If you so hate this country and offer nothing to her but your foul mouthing..GET OUT!
at 10:18 AM, 9/4/05
8/28/05
Gov. Kathleen Blanco, standing beside the mayor at a news conference, said President Bush called and personally appealed for a mandatory evacuation for the low-lying city, which is prone to flooding.
Yup! it's Bush's fault!!!!
8/28/05
Gov. Kathleen Blanco, standing beside the mayor at a news conference, said President Bush called and personally appealed for a mandatory evacuation for the low-lying city, which is prone to flooding.
Yup! it's Bush's fault!!!!
at 10:47 AM, 9/4/05
Question. The residents of NO that couldn't evacuate were advised to seek shelter at the convention center. Who issued that advisory? And shouldn't whomever it was be responsible to make sure there was food, water and medical supplies there? And if there wasn't ask for help? Or let someone else know of the circumstance? These people were doing what they were told and were let down. Media has been blaming the feds because of the problems there but was it the feds who told them to go there? Or was this just a huge communication lapse on the part of local government. I don't get it and haven't heard it explained. I'm not being saracastic here, simply looking for answers.
Question. The residents of NO that couldn't evacuate were advised to seek shelter at the convention center. Who issued that advisory? And shouldn't whomever it was be responsible to make sure there was food, water and medical supplies there? And if there wasn't ask for help? Or let someone else know of the circumstance? These people were doing what they were told and were let down. Media has been blaming the feds because of the problems there but was it the feds who told them to go there? Or was this just a huge communication lapse on the part of local government. I don't get it and haven't heard it explained. I'm not being saracastic here, simply looking for answers.
at 01:25 PM, 9/4/05
FIRE! I am SO GLAD that you KNOW how to USE YOUR CAPS LOCK BUTTON!
...and that you've got your Sean-Hannity-and-Michael-Savage-based drivel memorized so well! I can truly feel the love you have for your fellow man. Try breathing deeply a few times.
I blame the governor, and I blame the mayor, and I blame the president, OK? Are you happy? But I am NOT head of FEMA. It's not my job to make the evacuation plans for New Orleans. Bush put a massive infrastructure in place for situations like this, and it was an unmitigated failure. Under Clinton, at least the head of FEMA had disaster experience.
And you guys are latching onto "President Bush appealed for a mandatory evacuation"? Look, who's fault is it when an organization fails? It's the fault of the guy in charge. You have a strange "the buck stops here, unless we've failed, in which case it stops much lower" attitude.
FIRE! I am SO GLAD that you KNOW how to USE YOUR CAPS LOCK BUTTON!
...and that you've got your Sean-Hannity-and-Michael-Savage-based drivel memorized so well! I can truly feel the love you have for your fellow man. Try breathing deeply a few times.
I blame the governor, and I blame the mayor, and I blame the president, OK? Are you happy? But I am NOT head of FEMA. It's not my job to make the evacuation plans for New Orleans. Bush put a massive infrastructure in place for situations like this, and it was an unmitigated failure. Under Clinton, at least the head of FEMA had disaster experience.
And you guys are latching onto "President Bush appealed for a mandatory evacuation"? Look, who's fault is it when an organization fails? It's the fault of the guy in charge. You have a strange "the buck stops here, unless we've failed, in which case it stops much lower" attitude.
at 01:27 PM, 9/4/05
Ruth: As far as I've heard, the convention center wasn't an official shelter. It was big, open, and not flooded, though, so people made it into a shelter. People were blasting the feds because, a day after the media had reported that the people there had no food or water, the chief of FEMA apparently didn't know that there were even people in it.
Ruth: As far as I've heard, the convention center wasn't an official shelter. It was big, open, and not flooded, though, so people made it into a shelter. People were blasting the feds because, a day after the media had reported that the people there had no food or water, the chief of FEMA apparently didn't know that there were even people in it.
BJ at 01:32 PM, 9/4/05
Carl, Ruth: I was home alone on the SF Peninsula during the Loma Prieta earthquake, my husband out of town on business, couldn't get back for three days. He had no idea if I was okay but he knew that we had supplies and that I could turn off the gas and water and use the handgun.
No power, gas, phones, water. House doors stuck, the garage doors went off the track and the cars were trapped. There was no where to go anyway as the freeways were impassable. I was scared, I admit to sitting in my dark house that first night with a portable radio as the earth still heaved, clutching the dog and crying...and we were lucky with only superficial damage to the house.
Never once in 1989 did I think about what the President could or would do for me. It is absurd. Our neighborhood had a plan. An appointed committee searched every house, we had a list of all residents, pets and who had special needs. We had lists of who had skills, medical expertise and tools. We pooled and shared food and water with the few who hadn't prepared well enough. It was a week before the power came back on and the grocery stores reopened and gasoline could be pumped.
You can't become part of the problem for first responders by not having critical meds, water or food stored. Ready-to-eat canned soup or pasta keeps well, and you can eat it cold, pudding cups, canned fruit. All cheap, nutritious and easy to store. Large plastic trash bags and a 5-gal bucket make a toilet, you can use the clean water in the toilet tanks for hygiene and most hot water tanks hold about 30 gals of potable water.
Can any of you turn off your power, natural gas or water in the next two minutes? In the dark? Tape a wrench to the pipe. What if you had to get of your home, perhaps never to see it again, in 20 minutes? What would you take? Do you have a checklist posted so you can quickly gather items you will need? Have your critical papers in a case ready to go? Your medications? Do you drive until your tank is empty before refilling?
Those of you in earthquake country: do you keep a working flashlight, a crowbar or hammer, heavy gloves and a pair of sturdy shoes under the bed? You may have force your way out of your bedroom in the dark with broken glass on the floor.
Is your hot water tank strapped to the wall?
Do you have windows, light fittings, pictures or photos over or near your bed? Heavy furniture or bookcases that may tip onto the bed? Move 'em, today.
When your local authorities tell you that you need to expect NO HELP for up to 2 weeks; they mean it folks.
NO. HELP.
Get your act together today if you live in an area where a natural disaster is likely.
Carl, Ruth: I was home alone on the SF Peninsula during the Loma Prieta earthquake, my husband out of town on business, couldn't get back for three days. He had no idea if I was okay but he knew that we had supplies and that I could turn off the gas and water and use the handgun.
No power, gas, phones, water. House doors stuck, the garage doors went off the track and the cars were trapped. There was no where to go anyway as the freeways were impassable. I was scared, I admit to sitting in my dark house that first night with a portable radio as the earth still heaved, clutching the dog and crying...and we were lucky with only superficial damage to the house.
Never once in 1989 did I think about what the President could or would do for me. It is absurd. Our neighborhood had a plan. An appointed committee searched every house, we had a list of all residents, pets and who had special needs. We had lists of who had skills, medical expertise and tools. We pooled and shared food and water with the few who hadn't prepared well enough. It was a week before the power came back on and the grocery stores reopened and gasoline could be pumped.
You can't become part of the problem for first responders by not having critical meds, water or food stored. Ready-to-eat canned soup or pasta keeps well, and you can eat it cold, pudding cups, canned fruit. All cheap, nutritious and easy to store. Large plastic trash bags and a 5-gal bucket make a toilet, you can use the clean water in the toilet tanks for hygiene and most hot water tanks hold about 30 gals of potable water.
Can any of you turn off your power, natural gas or water in the next two minutes? In the dark? Tape a wrench to the pipe. What if you had to get of your home, perhaps never to see it again, in 20 minutes? What would you take? Do you have a checklist posted so you can quickly gather items you will need? Have your critical papers in a case ready to go? Your medications? Do you drive until your tank is empty before refilling?
Those of you in earthquake country: do you keep a working flashlight, a crowbar or hammer, heavy gloves and a pair of sturdy shoes under the bed? You may have force your way out of your bedroom in the dark with broken glass on the floor.
Is your hot water tank strapped to the wall?
Do you have windows, light fittings, pictures or photos over or near your bed? Heavy furniture or bookcases that may tip onto the bed? Move 'em, today.
When your local authorities tell you that you need to expect NO HELP for up to 2 weeks; they mean it folks.
NO. HELP.
Get your act together today if you live in an area where a natural disaster is likely.
at 02:48 PM, 9/4/05
Excellent advice BJ. Thanks.
Excellent advice BJ. Thanks.
at 11:39 AM, 9/5/05
But I am NOT head of FEMA. It's not my job to make the evacuation plans for New Orleans
Nor is it FEMA's. There was and is a detailed plan for emergencies in N.O. and the state. The city will use the public transit buses and school buses to evacuate those that are without transportation. The buses are to make mapped rounds that are published telling citizens which street corners they are to walk to along with carry-on necessities. I have seen the math that shows two trips per bus in the two days before landfall would have emptied the city. The plan also calls for school buses to be used in this evac. It even has phone numbers and addresses of the drivers. I have a photo of 205 school buses parked in a lake of water. Counting the city buses, there were well over 500 buses available. Where was the mayor? This is his plan. His personally appointed city safety director at $147,000 per year didn't utilize the mayors plan. This man is also the cities point man with FEMA.
It's important to realize here! The feds cannot do a whole laundry list of things until the Gov. declares a state of emergency. As far as I know this has yet to be done. The Feds are Constitutionally limited to certain actions. They are not our mommy and daddy. The state has certain powers given by the founders, in the Constitution of the United States of America. Bottom line is they failed to implement their own disaster plan.
The Governor admitted on a newscast that the President of the United States, had called her personally to urge a mandatory evac. for New Orleans, and she had conferred with the Mayor to get him to issue the order. Seems to me the President was on top of the situation. His only fault was expecting that the elected officials were adults.
It seems New Orleans has taken down the city website area which contained the detailed disaster plan. I'm sure it has been backed up in diverse locations and my sources will uncover a copy sooner or later.
If there is blame to assign, and I'm sure there is. Lets wait till the recovery is underway and then send a truth finding, fact finding commission to do the digging.
HongKongCharlieX
But I am NOT head of FEMA. It's not my job to make the evacuation plans for New Orleans
Nor is it FEMA's. There was and is a detailed plan for emergencies in N.O. and the state. The city will use the public transit buses and school buses to evacuate those that are without transportation. The buses are to make mapped rounds that are published telling citizens which street corners they are to walk to along with carry-on necessities. I have seen the math that shows two trips per bus in the two days before landfall would have emptied the city. The plan also calls for school buses to be used in this evac. It even has phone numbers and addresses of the drivers. I have a photo of 205 school buses parked in a lake of water. Counting the city buses, there were well over 500 buses available. Where was the mayor? This is his plan. His personally appointed city safety director at $147,000 per year didn't utilize the mayors plan. This man is also the cities point man with FEMA.
It's important to realize here! The feds cannot do a whole laundry list of things until the Gov. declares a state of emergency. As far as I know this has yet to be done. The Feds are Constitutionally limited to certain actions. They are not our mommy and daddy. The state has certain powers given by the founders, in the Constitution of the United States of America. Bottom line is they failed to implement their own disaster plan.
The Governor admitted on a newscast that the President of the United States, had called her personally to urge a mandatory evac. for New Orleans, and she had conferred with the Mayor to get him to issue the order. Seems to me the President was on top of the situation. His only fault was expecting that the elected officials were adults.
It seems New Orleans has taken down the city website area which contained the detailed disaster plan. I'm sure it has been backed up in diverse locations and my sources will uncover a copy sooner or later.
If there is blame to assign, and I'm sure there is. Lets wait till the recovery is underway and then send a truth finding, fact finding commission to do the digging.
HongKongCharlieX
at 10:40 AM, 9/6/05
I found this forum where they are talking the day before the Hurricane hit. It is time dated and saw this posted.......
stormtrackerAug 28 2005, 01:57 AM
I'm monitoring a few N.O stations and newspapers and NOTHING has been said about a mandatory evac. In fact, they are interviewing some official and he is saying there really is no difference between a voluntary evac and mandatory and they don't see the need to order one because they (N.O) don't have enough shelters to tell people to leave their homes.
EDIT: Official is Dr. Walter Maestri, director of Jefferson County Emer. Management
As you can see it was edited and the public official was added that same day. If you do a search on this official you will see that he was against the president before the hurricane. Could anyone find the anything more on this?
I found this forum where they are talking the day before the Hurricane hit. It is time dated and saw this posted.......
stormtrackerAug 28 2005, 01:57 AM
I'm monitoring a few N.O stations and newspapers and NOTHING has been said about a mandatory evac. In fact, they are interviewing some official and he is saying there really is no difference between a voluntary evac and mandatory and they don't see the need to order one because they (N.O) don't have enough shelters to tell people to leave their homes.
EDIT: Official is Dr. Walter Maestri, director of Jefferson County Emer. Management
As you can see it was edited and the public official was added that same day. If you do a search on this official you will see that he was against the president before the hurricane. Could anyone find the anything more on this?
at 06:23 PM, 9/7/05
What a bunch of idiots. Absolve George bush at all costs. Then you don't have to take that "personal responsibility" for voting for him.
I don't know who you are and stumbled onto this site and don't really care what point you're trying to make.
Even if the mayor and the governor breached the levees with a hammer and chisel, the Federal government is supposed to come to the rescue. They didn't (period). That's even more offensive since the governor asked for and received a Federal State of Emergency before the storm came.
According to you, it seems our new and improved "keep us safe" government can't even deal with arguably inept local officials. I wonder how they can deal with those who actually do have a plan.
This is two disasters, two wars, a blown budget, a prison scandal, a deterioration of privacy, loss of international goodwill, a traitor in the white house revealing secret identities...and the list goes on.
I'm just glad none of it's the president's fault. If the buck stopped at the White House, then the president might have to actually take some of that "personal responsibility" the bushbots love to force down other folks' throats....
What a bunch of idiots. Absolve George bush at all costs. Then you don't have to take that "personal responsibility" for voting for him.
I don't know who you are and stumbled onto this site and don't really care what point you're trying to make.
Even if the mayor and the governor breached the levees with a hammer and chisel, the Federal government is supposed to come to the rescue. They didn't (period). That's even more offensive since the governor asked for and received a Federal State of Emergency before the storm came.
According to you, it seems our new and improved "keep us safe" government can't even deal with arguably inept local officials. I wonder how they can deal with those who actually do have a plan.
This is two disasters, two wars, a blown budget, a prison scandal, a deterioration of privacy, loss of international goodwill, a traitor in the white house revealing secret identities...and the list goes on.
I'm just glad none of it's the president's fault. If the buck stopped at the White House, then the president might have to actually take some of that "personal responsibility" the bushbots love to force down other folks' throats....
Aaron at 06:48 PM, 9/7/05
Thanks for the constructive comments there. Unfortunately...
Bush really has zip to do with it, and most people understand enough about the functioning of government to know that. I recommend a good Civics class.
Thanks for the constructive comments there. Unfortunately...
the Federal government is supposed to come to the rescue...starts you off on an entirely false premise. Disaster management is first and foremost, and always has been, a state duty. (That's why virtually all emergency management powers, including the police power, control of first responders, evacuation authority, and command of the National Guard are vested in state and/or local officials.) When FEMA ran drills and planned for this scenario in conjunction with the State of Louisiana, they found that it would take several days to get major relief in. ("Period.") It's not easy to get a huge convoy (and the support it has to have) into a devastated area the size of a small country. They delivered exactly what they promised, the same thing that every other major disaster gets, and has gotten for two decades.
Bush really has zip to do with it, and most people understand enough about the functioning of government to know that. I recommend a good Civics class.
at 02:38 PM, 9/15/05
Google cache of City of New Orleans Comprehensive Emergency Management Plan (which seems to have been deleted from the official city website).
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:6CwVGOyL-lYJ:www.cityofno.com/SystemModules/PrintPage.aspx?portal=46&tabid=26+&hl=en&start=1
The mayor should have used "his" city buses to evac the elderly & infirm.
Google cache of City of New Orleans Comprehensive Emergency Management Plan (which seems to have been deleted from the official city website).
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:6CwVGOyL-lYJ:www.cityofno.com/SystemModules/PrintPage.aspx?portal=46&tabid=26+&hl=en&start=1
The mayor should have used "his" city buses to evac the elderly & infirm.
Comment Policy: Irrelevant or obscene posts, including ad hominem attacks, SPAM, crazed ranting, and threats of violence may be removed at the owner of this site's discretion.
